Not arguing for or against anything, just adding my $0.02

@amanda.hinchman-dominguez In off-shore drilling the ratio is 99.7% men. Why are there no bootcamps for getting women into off-shore drilling. Think about it.

Careful.

Now, I have very specific views on the idea of community for diversity. For example, I complete disagree with Sheryl Sandberg's Lean In program

@poohbar I'm not an expert in off-shore drilling 🙂 I cannot answer for that

@Ruckus brings up a good point about diversity camps as well. It is not to say diversity ONLY

@amanda.hinchman-dominguez Purely out of curiosity, have you found such camps to be more effective if they include only the target demographic, or if they just target the demographic but allow anyone to join?

easier example, what about teachers? why are we not freaking out that there is not enough men in teaching?

this specific one was women only and 100% excluded whoever identified as a male

what about cosmetology?

@Ruckus and another good point!!! I think it is FAR more effective to target the demographic but not only ALLOW people to join, but encourage people of power to advocate for majority demographics to join

You want the opportunity to create a safe space, but also the opportunity to listen to a minority demographic as a group, since we are usually spread out

My girlfriend has decided to learn front-end dev. It took her 5 months of self study from online sources. Then she found a job with no issues and her salary is above average. There was not a single person that would talk down to her and not a single issue she run into because of being a woman. I know it's very anecdotal but I feel like looking just at the final ratio is very short-sighted and does not tell even half of the story.

@amanda.hinchman-dominguez Good to know. I've often wondered if demographic targeting works better if there if participation is restricted to the demographic (for example, will more women or minorities participate if they know there will only be others in their demographic (maybe it feels safer or something?))

I have very little experience in this regard, so please excuse my ignorance.

Pretty much everyone I work with (including myself) is a white middle-aged male, but that's a lot to do with both demographics and culture around here (people are strongly conservative and religious, so the working population tends to be mostly male in most industries).

@poohbar I agree, the ratio is not even the tip of the discussion. Did you know that 3/4 women are likely to experience unwanted sexual advances in the tech industry?

While we can go down a rabbit hole talking about what women experience that makes them not want to stay technical, I think it could be better to talk about what can we do to encourage a healthier pipeline and one without leaks

What I am trying to hint at is that I think there is nothing wrong with the pipeline and that different jobs naturally attract different demographics.

@Ruckus Have you ever been to GHC? I have had some interesting experiences on the women/men social dynamics there

Again, forgive me for being ignorant, but I don't even know what that is.

@Ruckus I think many of us have not had enough experience. But you are right to an extent, being around a demographic can feel safer. I think it is dangerous to say that we don't feel safe around our coworkers, but that can be the feeling in certain and specific instances. It's not about sexism or racism, but without a doubt, those are problems to address universally, but it is about feeling that "you are what computer science looks like", not "I don't look like what a computer scientist should look like"

I call it "Imposter Syndrome"

@poohbar Let's not start another "Google's Echo Chamber" discussion. I find they are almost never helpful.

@Ruckus GHC is the Grace Hopper Conference, also under ACM for women

@poohbar I don't think it's that we are afraid to speak about the issue - I'd like to pick it up tonight for sure, but I can't atm cause I'm at work and I'm multitasking haha. I wanted to keep it within the scope of improving the pipeline for diversity

Ok, so what specifically do you feel like is lacking in the pipeline?

@poohbar and I believe there is something wrong with the pipeline, if over a span of 30 years, there is a decrease by 50% of women in a technical role, and that many women do not stay in a technical position

In fact, I give advice to women around me to stay away from gaining certifications or skills that imply "soft skills", because that is what you can get stuck with

Could it be that the job itself has changed in the last 30 years and became less attractive to women for some reason?