John Rose et al has announced recently that java will get fi

Question

John Rose et al has announced recently that java will get fibers a k a coroutines

defhlt · Answer

do you have a link

sreich · Answer

Not very exciting Java can get most of kotlin features and it still won t have them all or the conciseness Or most importantly null safety

nimtiazm · Answer

< defhlt> Look for devoxx 2017 John Rose on YouTube

nimtiazm · Answer

< sreich> yup that s correct But legacy is a big and interesting factor Plus performance is another factor that natural gives java some leverage

sreich · Answer

Performance of what gives Java leverage Kotlin is more performant in many areas

nimtiazm · Answer

If you run compute intensive routines like nbody and redux etc you ll see some margin

nimtiazm · Answer

but Kotlin by far is way better than others on the jvm

sreich · Answer

You ve actually properly benchmarked this I don t see how that could possibly be the case it s all JVM byte code and kotlin has other nice things such as inline

nimtiazm · Answer

Yes inline and string interpolation are really good in Kotlin but if you use a similarly tightly packed java code there ll be some margin there

sreich · Answer

this sounds like some real hand waving and you can do the same in kotlin ergo java isn t more optimized

nimtiazm · Answer

If you argue that way then runtime intrinsics add a tiny cost too Can t do anything about that But that s not the whole point either

nimtiazm · Answer

Also don t forget every top level val and fun you add here and there will incur class loader cost Roughly these factors add up to the margin I m taking about But I m pretty confident that Kotlin compiler runtime team will improve that further

sreich · Answer

this still sounds like you don t have any tangible benchmarks but are just making assumptions that one is measurably faster honestly and that s not what one should do when it comes to performance

nimtiazm · Answer

I ve tried these <http benchmarksgame alioth debian org>

nimtiazm · Answer

I have published back my Kotlin ports yet I have no idea when and where did you comprehend that I m basing on assumption rather than findings But that s fine It s the internet after all

Ian · Answer

< nimtiazm> I think his assumption was reasonable given that he already asked you if you have benchmarks and you ignored the question If you have data to support your unlikely claim then please show it

pniederw · Answer

< nimtiazm> that wasn t an announcement at all just one of many post valhalla ideas

nimtiazm · Answer

Of course Oracle s safe harbor statement says it can be all vaporware slightly smiling face However experience says whatever those engineers disclose to the public is whatever they re working on Yes it s unclear if it ll be java 10 or 11 or 12 but the kind of competition they re getting from languages like Kotlin they ll do it sooner than later

pniederw · Answer

coroutines were categorically ruled out for java 10 by mark reinhold

pniederw · Answer

the talk you are referring to contains ideas for the next 10 20 years of the jvm most of these things aren t actively being worked on

pniederw · Answer

in a product sense

pniederw · Answer

the most serious work on java coroutines I m aware of to date is <http ssw jku at Research Papers Stadler11Master Stadler11Master pdf>